Well, at this point it seems to be "rare chance of heart problems, primarily in younger men" vs "rare chance of blood clotting, primarily in younger women", if I recall correctly?

If you're afraid of them and are NEET enough to not go outside much, you could also consider holding out for Novavax or Sanofi/GSK's vaccines - they contain pre-made synthetic spike protein instead of spike protein generators (be it in the form of mRNA or a viral vector), so in that sense they work more or less like a traditional "vaccine".

Either way, I'm going for the second dose soon (mRNA). I haven't had any adverse symptoms which would make me unwilling to do so - at least not any that I can't write off as psychosomatic. If I die, at least it's going to be in pursuit of science... but it does make you wonder if we're not straining the immune system a bit too much, in an attempt to build truly long-lasting protection. I also wonder if the spacing of doses has some effect on the variables - remember that AstraZeneca's viral vector vaccine is spaced at 8-12 weeks, while Pfizer and Moderna's mRNA vaccines are spaced at 3-5 weeks.

Not a doctor, though.

Post edited on 15th Jun 2021, 10:28pm

>>38390
>but there sadly don't seem to be any sane places to discuss these things.
Those that ban such discussion and thus relegate them to places like /pol/ and other "fringe" areas should be considered criminals. And for what? Political gain? Money? Whatever it is, it's disgusting, and even as a useless NEET, I find myself looking down on these people.

>>38391
Yeah the J&J ironically looks to be a bit safer, since the cause/mechanism for the blood-clotting is understood at this point. And since J&J uses an adenovirus instead of mrna directly, the uptake by the cells should be a bit more selective than the more indiscriminate uptake possible with mrna (iirc adenovirus requires a certain protein on the extracellular matrix to bind to the cell). Although it seems adenoviruses have also been associated with myocarditis, so it's possible that the same could happen there too and it's not been detected yet because far fewer people have taken that in the US.

But either way it's quite aggravating that everyone's just blindly advocating for vaccination without taking into account risks on both sides of the equation. You're trading off risk from getting covid and any possible effects from that (both known and hitherto unknown) versus risks from the vaccine (both known and unknown). It's known that covid mortality for young healthy people is basically nil, so that leaves the issue of post-viral fatigue (now termed "long covid") that people have experienced weighted by the probability of acquiring it in the first place.

But it's been excruciatingly difficult to find any information on the other side of the equation: /pol/ has been the only place where I've been able to find criticism but even then finding rational discussion backed by plausible biological mechanisms is like finding a needle in the haystack amongst the other drivel about 5G, gene therapy, and bill gates. The working assumption of both vaccines seems to be that A) the delivered payloads stays where you put it (in the muscle) instead of going systemic and circulating throughout the whole system and B) Getting cells to express the spike protein is safe. I think (B) on its own is true so long as the cells in consideration are cells that the body can regrow (e.g. muscle), since any damage is just limited to cell death. But we know that (A) is not true since studies [1] have shown that even with ideal administration a small percentage makes its way to the liver. There aren't any major veins or arteries near the deltoid so while it shouldn't be a major issue as the majority should remain close to that site in the muscle, perhaps the small amount that does leak and cause expression in other cells is what's causing these observed side-effects (especially amplified on the second dose since by that point the immune response is compounded).

There is also the issue of herd immunity of course, and while appeals to that might be good on a global level on an individual level it seems much more rational to maximize your own well-being instead – at least given the current uncertainties.

[1] https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2021/05/04/spike-protein-behavior

>>38392
Yup that seems to summarize the (known) side-effects. Sadly novavax is taking quite a while and still hasn't applied for EUA (which is good that they're not rushing things, but unfortunate given that the US market is basically conceded at this point I'm not sure they're going to even bother distributing it here).

Post edited on 15th Jun 2021, 11:13pm

>>38393
>areas should be considered criminals
Absolutely, I've seen posts get removed that were just describing symptoms after the vaccine. Of course the effect of this is to make me extremely suspicious of these sites and then I wonder what else I'm not seeing. I don't want to go to /pol/ though, the mere catalog is often gross. I'm left ignoring most of the internet.

>>38394
The thing is, people are afraid of mutations - there's already concern over the so-called "Delta" variant, which is the one that, according to some analysts, managed to both become more infectious and more severe in terms of symptoms. The less the virus is spreading around, the less likely it is to continue mutating. I think this is what's driving some chunk of the vaccine push - the assumption that things may or may not get worse based on random number generation unless we curb the virus as much as possible.

What I'm afraid of is that because of the limited amount of people actually getting jabbed in many areas, plus the economically advocated push for re-opening borders and travel, we might not get that - that is, while the people who took the vaccine will generally be protected from current and similar variants, the people who didn't will be numerous enough to continue mutating the virus into variants; this will lead to a world of necessary yearly booster shots for some time...

Another factor is hospitals - vaccinations promote reduction of the amount of severe COVID cases, which means hospitals can now function better; at least in my country, this is great for many patients with life-threatening, non-COVID illnesses.

I don't really have an answer for the fact that a small number of people will probably die due to side effects from the vaccine. I am somewhat of a believer in collective ideology, but I also understand "oh he died for the good of everyone else" is really not the answer I can give to a grieving family.

>>38395
It's fear-driven. Both fear of such warnings reducing the number of vaccinations, as well as - rarely - fear of state actors amplifying such cases for their own gain (Estonia asserts Russia has been doing this here in particular).

>>38396
I don't think boosters may be required since I recall reading that people infected with the original sars coronavirus still have antibodies against that. So the antibodies from the vaccine should be enough for a decade at least. And I'm not a biochem guy but it seems the spike protein is integral to the function of the virus so that's unlikely to mutate enough to render current vaccines completely ineffective, but it does seem there are lower antibody rates [1].

An interesting hybrid approach might be to reduce the number of doses, amount of payload in each dose, or play with dose interval based on age group. Two doses 3 weeks apart is probably overkill for most healthy adults, and was likely chosen for the trials only to guarantee a rapid robust immune response for all ages (especially elderly). Certainly those who already had covid don't need 2 doses.

At the very least better reporting infrastructure should be in place. For instance, before receiving a second dose people should be made to fill out a questionnaire of all symptoms they experienced after the first dose. There's VAERS in the US but that's passive reporting system and I doubt most people are even aware that it exists.

[1] https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/6/16/how-covid-vaccines-work-against-delta-variant

Post edited on 16th Jun 2021, 12:16pm

>>38397
>For instance, before receiving a second dose people should be made to fill out a questionnaire of all symptoms they experienced after the first dose.

In my country, that is the case - the expected procedure for getting vaccinated is as follows:

1. Sign up for a given timeslot at a given vaccination point for a given vaccine,
2. Fill out a basic questionnaire - the intent is to highlight people who have adverse conditions which either prohibit taking the vaccine, or require additional medical consultation. This includes asking about vaccine side effects and the first dose. You also leave your contact information on it, in case something goes wrong I suppose.
3. Be referred to a "qualifying doctor" - they read your questionnaire, double-check verbally if you actually understand what you filled out, and are supposed to answer any additional questions.
4. Have the vaccine injected.
5. Spend 15 minutes at the vaccination point - this is to filter out any immediate adverse reactions.
6. Congratulations, you can now receive 5G data transmissions!

Now, knowing my country, not every place adheres to this perfectly, of course; however, the idea is there. In my case, steps 2-4 took about 10 minutes, but I don't have a history of adverse anything so that's the best case scenario.

>Two doses 3 weeks apart is probably overkill for most healthy adults, and was likely chosen for the trials only to guarantee a rapid robust immune response for all ages (especially elderly).

Part of the reason for speeding up is also rooted in what governments want, I think. My country went from 12 weeks for AZ and 5 weeks for Pfizer to 5 weeks for AZ and 3 weeks for Pfizer. I think at least a few other countries also amended their schedule to jab people at faster rates. There's two reasons to want the vaccination process over with faster: not wasting as many doses (they do cost a nice chunk of money after all), and being able to proclaim re-opening faster.

>>38398
Tangential, but I've always where the 5G nonsense came from. Maybe it's the marketers should be blamed for promising the moon with 5G, since the reality isn't even close to what the marketers were promising with IoT and smart cars.

As far as I understand, "5G" (which is really just marketing slogan for the updated 3GPP spec) is mainly just evolutionary improvements in spectrum efficiency, some changes to how negotiations are done to enable better latency, and the possibility of using millimeter wave range of the spectrum. But the mm wave is also mostly just marketing hype since even though the increased bandwidth can support more concurrent connections, there's still the issue of backhaul to the telco – so it's only going to be used for stadiums and such large arenas.

>>38392
There are other side-effects trends that the CDC hasn't acknowledged yet (nor may never acknowledge). Insomnia and non-transient tinnitus seems to be other side-effect that are occurring for some, and that's probably most concerning of all since these are in the realm of neurological issues which shouldn't be possible under the current working assumptions of the vaccine. (It also seems to be messing with women's periods, but that might just be caused by hormonal changes from immune response rather than any more specific mechanism). Probably the best way to get a survey of possible side-effects is to browse through r/CovidVaccinated which gives you slightly better quality of results than going to VAERS directly. The fact that a subreddit is currently the best place to get a realistic picture of the spread of possible side-effects reflecs terribly on the CDC and FDA. If they had any sense they'd set up some sort of keyword monitoring/clustering to detect possible patterns at the earliest possible time and react accordingly.

Post edited on 17th Jun 2021, 11:45pm

>>38053
>>38396
I think you're right, and in particular the current vaccines for this are non-sterilizing which means that not only is there possibility of transmission, there's also the increased selective pressure for it to mutate to evade antibodies. So ironically vaccinated people would be accelerating the mutation more than unvaccinated since vaccinated people are primed to produce only the narrow set of antibodies targetting that specific spike protein whereas unvaccinated people would probably generate a broader set. And given that coronaviruses are prone to mutation anyway, this is going to be an inherent flaw to any vaccine developed.

And of course they're going to use the fear over the new "delta" variant to re-impose lockdowns and mask wearing. I wonder how long this is going to play out, but there really doesn't seem to be a clear solution that doesn't pose risks to some segment of the population.

>>38390
(Same person as quoted) – Luckily I haven't had any other symptoms crop up, and upon some research I think what I'm (still) experiencing is costochondritis rather than myocarditis. Definitely not planning to take the second dose though, and I do slightly regret taking it under pressure from family whom I'm living with rather than waiting a few more months to see how things pan out.

>>38392
After doing some more digging, I think I was mistaken on my initial guess that J&J was "safer." While this isn't backed by anything rigorous, my intuition is that all of the current range of side-effects seen are a subset of the so-called "long covid" symptoms that people have experienced, and should be attributed to immune-system over-reaction rather than the spike protein itself. Consider the fact that from the CDC data we know that the increase in risk for myocarditis was greatest for those < 18, and that too after the second dose. If this was caused by the spike-protein itself circulating and disrupting activity, then I don't think there would exist this discrepancy between age groups and dose. Instead, what we see is that those affected the most are those with hair-trigger immune systems (the young, or possibly those with existing auto-immune conditions) and only after the body has already been primed for a strong response by the first dose. This parallels what the data shows with "long covid," which is experienced primarily by the young who recover from the virus itself but whose immune-system still remains overactive. Although maybe the age-discrepancy could be explained by differences in the rate at which cells express mrna...

I strongly suspect J&J would elicit the same condition as well, it's just that since pfizer is the only one approved for ages 12-18 it's easier to see the effects there. And theoretically novavax shouldn't be any different since it should trigger the same inflammation, although the total amount of spike protein delivered might be smaller than that which is expressed by the mrna which should help prevent this.

But given this, I think in terms of long-term and possible side-effects the worst that is likely to happen is that you develop symptoms similar to long-covid. The younger or more prone to auto-immune conditions you are (e.g. history of allergies), the more likely this is to happen.

>>38395
I've been down the rabbit-hole, and at this point I consider the CDC (& FDA) as agencies that are actively harming the people. They (and the rest of the media) had been dismissing treatments like Ivermectin outright, and only now are they beginning to study whether it could indeed be effective (previous studies have been mixed, but annecdotal reports have said that it works to speed recovery and help reduce "long covid" symptoms). And yet at the same time as they completely reject Ivermectin and stonewall further research, they approve Aducanumab which is even more controversial in its efficacy and for which we have no easy means of verifying its effectiveness. Similarly for vaccinating young people < 18 – despite other countries taking the rational approach and recommending against it or only a single dose, FDA has made no changes to recommendations.

In fact, it's almost like politics has become mixed into what should be purely objective discussions involving people's health.

>>38442
>Instead, what we see is that those affected the most are those with hair-trigger immune systems (the young, or possibly those with existing auto-immune conditions) and only after the body has already been primed for a strong response by the first dose.
The immune system is actually weakest in children, adolescents and the elderly, but strongest in adults (~20 and older and ~40 and younger). Immune system over-reaction in my opinion would also seem to be an incorrect assumption on the part of why the so-called "long COVID" symptoms do persist. Genuine immune system over-reactions result in like what seen during the 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic wherein adults experienced a "cytokine storm," and not children, adolescents, or the elderly. When disposing infected cells, the immune system dispatches cytokine cells, which destroy the infected cells. In most cases, this does not lead to further problems, but in the case of Spanish Flu, it resulted in the lungs of those afflicted filling with pus, which they would unceremoniously drown in. Otherwise, an immune system over-reactions would result in anaphylaxis - "blood pressure drops suddenly and your airways narrow, blocking breathing." [1]

[1] https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/anaphylaxis/symptoms-causes/syc-20351468

>>38545
Sorry. Got my facts a little mixed up with how COVID tends not to severely affect the young, but is more severe with age. It is still true that the immune system is weakest among children and the elderly, but it's most certainyly NOT true that the Spanish Flu didn't kill or more severely infect children or the elderly.

What was unique about Spanish Flu is that there was that pronounced spike in the middle of the mortality distribution, where young adults ended up succumbing to the illness as a consequence of their immune system over-reacting. Still, this would seem a point against the "immune system over-reactions causing 'long COVID'" hypothesis, since long COVID anecdotally seems to affect everyone, including children [1]. In particular this study found that, "12.9 per cent of UK children aged 2 to 11, and 14.5 per cent of children aged 12 to 16, still have symptoms five weeks after their first infection." Among 'older' people, "Among participants with COVID-19, persistent symptoms were reported by 17 of 64 patients (26.6%) aged 18 to 39 years, 25 of 83 patients (30.1%) aged 40 to 64 years, and 13 of 30 patients (43.3%) aged 65 years and older. Overall, 49 of 150 outpatients (32.7%), 5 of 16 hospitalized patients (31.3%)." [2] Over all, it would seem that approximately 30% of people from all age groups will experience long COVID symptoms, however, as of this point, I think it's fairly safe to say that the total duration of these symptoms is anyone's guess.


Sorry for any misunderstanding.

[1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7927578/
[2] https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2776560

>>38545
Good thoughts. I came across this recent paper [1] which seems to indicate that one cause may be that for long-haulers, the S1 subunit of the spike protein persists in monocytes even months after original covid infection. I wonder if this is the same cause of the rare but non-trivial side-effects of the vaccines, since it's the same underlying spike protein (modulo that 2p mutation).

This would explain the increased effects after the second dose, but not the seeming age-dependence for side-effects like myocarditis. Although since the viral-vector vaccines don't have this particular side effect occurring at observable rates, maybe that one is caused by the lipid nanoparticles triggering inflammatory responses.

[1] https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.25.449905v1.full.pdf

Post edited on 15th Jul 2021, 5:50pm

>>38547
Anonymous, I think you might just be onto something. I remembered reading about the coronavirus back when it first emerged and there was quite a bit of talk about how the coronavirus would infect cells, namely it used the ACE2 receptor on cells. In particular, the ACE2 receptor is involved in several processes such as mediating inflammation and blood pressure. That being the case, I really, really wonder if in cases of COVID long-haulers and the previously mentioned post-viral fatigue is a result of auto-immune disorder. What I mean by that is this: both the vaccines as well as the coronavirus itself work by targeting the spike protein which itself is mimicking angiotensin proteins in order to gain access to the cell. Hypothetically, if the trained immune system response was similar enough between recognizing the coronavirus spike protein and the angiotensin protein, the immune system might collect these proteins to the reciprocally binding protein on the surface of immune cells and antigen identifying proteins. Supposing this is truly the case, it would mean that the immune system is disrupting normal bodily function not as an over-reaction to disease, or even an inappropriate reaction, but merely that the particular orientation of the most common binding protein created by the immune system also so happened to affect BOTH the coronavirus' spike protein AND normal human proteins. In the case of post-viral fatigue, it may well be the case that it's not necessarily the same protein that gets affected, but otherwise has a similar outcome.

Otherwise, supposing this auto-immune disorder hypothesis is not correct, I wouldn't be surprised if the spike protein persisting in monocytes does explain the same situation but in reverse; rather than a decrease in angiotensin proteins, monocytes lysing possibly releases these stored spike proteins which inadvertently bind with ACE2 receptors otherwise interrupting their normal function, or causing expression of the same behavior as angiotensin causes.


These are just some spur of the moment thoughts of mine. I would be interested to know if there's been any research into these ideas at all.

They're rolling out "vaccine passports" and mandating these things for even employers not in the healthcare sector. All the while it's becoming evident that these things aren't even that effective at preventing transmission of the so-called "delta" variant. At this point it's either a genuine conspiracy with malicious intent to get every one to take these, or basically the same thing as social-justice fervor where people throw rationality to the wind and the vaccines are just a means of virtue-signaling (and especially given all the sunk costs, no one is going to admit that they overreacted and we should just let nature take its course).

>>38577
Something's definitely up.
The measures taken don't add up with the severity of COVID, a small chance of death doesn't require a more or less year-long lockdown.
And then there's how hard governments are pushing vaccines, some countries only allow vaccinated into businesses, getting paid for taking the shot, etc. etc.
Maybe it's just politicians getting paid off by big pharma, maybe they're just incompetent and paranoid, or there's actually some kind of conspiracy afoot. Either way, I'm definitely not taking that vaccine now.

>>38585
> politicians getting paid off by big pharma, maybe they're just incompetent and paranoid,
Realistically it's probably just that. Government overreacted at the beginning (which wasn't necessarily _wrong_ given that at the time it was a potentially unknown Made in China™ SARS-esque thing), and gave the pharma sector a shit ton of money to pump out vaccines asap. Of course the pharma guys will gladly take it, so they dusted off the questionably-safe mRNA vaccine tech they had sitting aronud to manufacturer these things at breakneck speed, did minimal safety validation, and started promoting the campaigns to get one jab in every arm. (Notice how governments always promote the 2-dose mRNA vaccines, even though the J&J arguably has a better safety profile at this point, and both are basically equualy (in)effecitve against the delta variants... I wonder why that is).

Meanwhile, the big businesses found out that these lockdowns are actually a great thing for them (I bet the large online retailers saw big increases in traffic), so they do everything in their interest to continue the momentum. And of course with how gullible the people are, just mention the covid boogeyman every day in the media and the people will voluntarily continue the charade. The politicians like this too, since the people are focusing on this stuff instead of being angry at the government, and they can make worthless statements to make themselves look good. And they get to blame everything on the unvaccinated people to further mask the charade. The people also become more dependent on the government due to relying on stimulus to make up for lost jobs.

So it's not a grand conspiracy theory orchestrated by a single person, and the conspiracy isn't about the contents of the vaccine itself per se, the conspiracy is in the continued effort to keep this charade going and it's undertaken by multiple parties.

>>38586
>both are basically equualy (in)effecitve against the delta variants... I wonder why that is
This is pretty much misinfo.
https://www.ft.com/content/5a24d39a-a702-40d2-876d-b12a524dc9a5

So I'm a bit worried now, guys. I think I may have gotten something this past week. Last sunday I got a slight tickle in my throat which would prompt me to cough here and then, but only rarely, a a little sore throat. I ended up spending the entire night wide awake, so the following day I was tired as fuck, then I got some sleep, but was still tired the following day, after another sleep night I was not tired anymore. I did not felt any other symptoms. The tickle and soreness went away but apparently I can't sense smells anymore? Did I had the 'rona or what? The symptoms were brand as fuck, a lot more milder than when I had a flu or a cold, so I thought I might have had an allergy. But now I am in doubt. I am not vaccinated. Do you guys think this is the 'rona or not? If it is then does it mean my body can fight it off naturally? Should I take the vax still after some days?

>>39224
You'll probably be fine unless you're really old or fat.

I think I've had it at least two times now, maybe more. It kinda sucks and is really annoying, but it's hardly the worst thing in the world.

>>39226
How long did it take you to recover your sense of smell?

>>39234
Just a couple days

Had it twice ( tested and confirmed at a clinic ), and it honestly felt like a regular cold to me. I didn't even get a fever once even though I had one fever this past year from a flu. Never got the vaccine, haven't even seen a regular physician for shots or a checkup in years. I'm sorry if some people suffered from it, but I didn't get anything from it except having to wear a mask. Now my work doesn't require it anymore, and I've suffered zero consequences from this virus. I don't have to worry if the vaccine is effective or not, because I never needed to take it and now with no masks it might as well have never happened for me.

I don't give too much of a shit about the political sides to this, it just genuinely did not impact my life. It seemed to me like nothing of note and that's how it seems to be fading out. Honestly, I never worry about this kind of thing, I've never paid much attention to health at all aside from brushing teeth, bathing, and keeping my sugar in balance.

From my perspective, I got sick once and didn’t even know about COVID-19. I never cared about masks or anything since I don’t really watch TV or have any social media, or believe anything in the news. After the vaccine rollout, I didn’t bother to get any because I didn’t care and never get a flu shot or anything anyway, but this seemed to make a lot of people really upset for some reason. I work in a sector that never shut down, and no one I know died of covid or anything. I’m privy to the data at my company, so I know that out of about 1000 employees, the only people who got covid after the vaccine rollout were people that were already vaccinated, but I don’t know if that means anything since most people were vaccinated. I still don’t care whatsoever about all this, and it just seems like hysteria to me.

If it were ever less obvious that the whole thing had been sensationalised by the media it should be fairly clear now that the whole thing has basically been forgotten with all the Ukraine drama

>>39430
That was pretty much my experience. I ignored the whole thing, and it never affected me aside from coworkers asking now and then if I'd taken my shots. Which, I hadn't, and told people, and now they've forgotten completely.

I think COVID-19 justified my indifference to world events. It didn't really impact me much. My senior year was cut in half which was nice. Good memories were made that winter.
So in retrospect, COVID-19 was alright.

>>39628
what happened during winter?

>>39631
Nothing in particular. I drank a lot. I played my PS2 and watched the first six or so episodes of Hell Girl in the garage a bunch of times. I would have watched something better, but there wasn't really internet access at home and I had the DVD set for the first season. If I wanted to watch something else, I'd have to jump through a lot of hoops or hope there was something interesting enough at the enthusiast store in the city.

>>39632
sound comfy. what game?

>>39648
I played a lot of games. I didn't have anything better to do. Quit my job a while before school was closed so I've been taking it easy ever since.

>>39628
Had a similar experience: once it was clear that COVID was being overhyped (not to say it didn't kill people), the confluence of resultant actions made the NEET life great.
Good to hear that you were enjoying yourself!

you guys ready for Round 2: Monkeypox?

I know it's mostly been spreading through gay sex parties so far, but the West's political class (especially in the EU) is full of degenerate fags and there's no way they're going to shut down gay sex orgies, so it's gonna continue to spread.

>>39691
Man, this shit is so disgusting. It makes me glad to be chaste. Even women these days are disease-ridden. I'll fill the void with 2D and not sticking my dick into the great unknown.
Even if it's mostly an issue with the gays, somehow I think it's not going to be so isolated as HIV was.

>>39691
I'm more fearful of the government response to it than the disease itself...

>>39701
same for covid

>>39691
The smallpox vaccine is already 85% effective, and a vaccine for that specifically came out last year. It's a total non-story.

im thinking of getting the jab. i know things have quieted down, but my fear of going out has only increased, i get paranoid when seeing anyone. i think getting this fucking thing will help me a little.

>>41165
It seems a bit late for that. I ended up getting it much against my will. Thankfully it hasn't harmed me, but other people weren't so lucky. From where it stands now it seems like your risk is the same whether you take that or get sick normally.

>>41166
>It seems a bit late for that.
What do you mean?
The ones who had problems what did they had and what brand they took?

>>41167
I'm not that well informed on which particular ones they took. But what I mean is by now the virus has been supplanted by milder mutations while the vaccine has proved mostly ineffective (not necessarily bad unless you get unlucky, but useless).

>>41165
I've gotten the vaccine 3 times and it never made me feel sick or anything like that. I got moderna.
I think on the first one I felt slightly sick but I had a nap and was okay.

I've never gotten the virus and I wear an N-95 mask everywhere I go.

>>41165
Why? The risk reward ratio is skewed heavily in favor of the vaccine doing more harm than good.
>>41167
Brand doesn't matter, all carry the same danger since they all actively code for the same spike protein. Probably the chinese and russian vaccines which are inactivated whole-virus are much safer. Next riskier is the adenovirus ones, then riskier than that is pfizer, then riskiest is moderna. Novavax is a wildcard, maybe somewhere between the sino one and adenovirus?

>>41186
>Why?
Because I used to be very anxious about health related stuff much before 2020. I can't stand people coughing etc. When I see someone doing it I flinch really hard and get the fuck out as soon as possible. Since around mid 2022 my fear increased dramatically. I can't stand even the thought of going out. So I was thinking if I took this thing my worries might ease down a little bit. But the thing is just after my post someone mentions they had effects from the vaccine and long haulers from the vaccine. My already paranoid mind riddled with ideas of reference is now afraid this might be a sign or something. But I also get signs to take it. I don't know realistically for how much longer I can keep living cooped up like this.
As for the brand I read a little and the pfizer seems more safer than astrazeneca, because of fewer blood problems, and lesser side-effects. I was thinking of taking the pfizer. The novavax looked promising but some japanese guy died after taking it, some months ago. It also suffer from much the same problems as the others.
Speaking from people I know, my mother had a really tough night after taking astrazeneca, and my grandpa's caretaker was diagnosed with a severe case of the very thing she was being vaccinated against. She had to go to the hospital and it looked very scary. Apparently this is a risk with inactive vaccines.
Regarding comorbidities, I am 24 not even remotely fat. Maybe a little underweight. My cholesterol is a little higher than the recommended but not so high that it is considered high or risky.
Everytime I get anything I start panicking that it could be the end. Last month I got something, idk what, just feeling nauseous and really tired. Nearly panicked.
That's it.

>>41192
What exactly are you scared of? Maybe the original (alpha?) variant was something to be feared considering it does seem to mess people up, but the new strains are quite literally the common cold and you get over it in about 1 day. As a young male you are more likely to get myocarditis from the vaccine than from the virus. Ignore those stats at your own peril.

>pfizer seems more safer than astrazeneca
No, the mrna based vaccines have higher rates of myocarditis and elicit long term changes in igg4 antibody expression, which the adenovirus based vaccines do not.

>risk with inactive vaccines.
None of these are inactive vaccines.

It seems to me you are more influenced by the media than you realize, considering you view pfizer as the safest option when by all accounts for young males the risk profile for Western vaccines is in fact lowest for the adenovirus based ones, on several dimensions.

>>41193
>the new strains are quite literally the common cold and you get over it in about 1 day.
Took me about a week earlier this year. It wasn't really that bad though, mostly just felt sleepy, had a sore throat, and everything tasted awful.

I got vaccinated twice (Pfizer and Moderna) and didn't have any adverse effects apart from a sore arm. Though I suppose it could've been pure luck.

>>41195
Seems to vary by the lot number, see howbadismybatch. Not sure if that effect is from questionable QC or just standard population density effect though.

But you can look at the graphs yourself for myocarditis rates in young males broken down by dose and manufacturer. 2x moderna is 6x rate of myocarditis compared to natural infection with the original strain.

My job finally stopped making us take tempt tests before we could enter the building.

There's an interesting study that seems to escaped the notice of even the critical-thinking parts of the covid-adjacent community. [1] shows that not only do the mrna-based vaccines mainly transfect _immune cells_ rather than muscle cells as was originally claimed, but that the translation-lifetime once inside these immune cells is prolonged by presence of TENT5A which readenlyates the poly-a tail that would usually become degraded over time. I think that this explains almost everything we've seen associated with the vaccine:

1) We know from Bruce Patterson's previous work that long covid (with the real virus) is associated with viral persistence in long-lived monocytes. [2] is an academic paper which corroborates this and shows the vaccine-generated spike protein can persist in a similar fashion. This now provides an explanation for why in some people this persistence occurs. Perhaps in some subset the readenlyation process occurs faster than the degradation process (maybe tent5a is replenished quicker), and so things get stuck in a loop that only ends when the cell itself dies. Some immune cells can be long-lived though.

2) The above likely also alters natural immune function, and the generated spike proteins possibly do further downstream damage.

3) This also explains the long-term igg4 buildup that has been seen 6months out from the mrna doses, since it would be a consequence of the unbroken translation process.

4) It might also explain the myocarditis, as immune cells basically go everywhere throughout the body, and from the above they might be dragging spike protein along with them doing peripheral damage.

[1] https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.12.01.518149v2.full
[2] https://www.europeanreview.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/013-019-2.pdf