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20088 No. 20088 [Edit]
What is "moe"? What is the "moe feeling" you talk about? Why have you turned an old meme from Azumanga into a pseudo-spiritual movement? I apologize if this comes off as derisive, but I am genuinely curious.
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>> No. 20089 [Edit]
You apologize in case you come off as derisive, but what I'm more concerned about is... How did you end up in this board and still never have purposefully or accidentally dwelt on what moe is (or is meant to be)? I hate to link wikepedia, but you will find all your answers (with proper citations to interviews, statements, annotations, etc.) to the question you're asking:
>> No. 20090 [Edit]

I saw this YouTube video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YtwPPsBKGQ), and I was more or less confused by the whole thing. I didn't want to write off a group of people as "crazy" just because of a video, so I decided to do some research on my own. I found this board, and I noticed a lot of the anons here talking about "moe" and the "moe feeling". After reading that wikipedia article, I guess I can say I understand the "moe" feeling - albeit not to the degree that many here have. Part of what confuses me is how people are able to feel so connected and passionate for characters that have such a limited window of "growth", so to speak. That is to say - how do these characters "exist" to you? Within their canon, looping endlessly? Or a sort of abstract group of concepts that the character symbolizes to you? Or is it something else?
>> No. 20091 [Edit]
That video is concentrated cancer... geez.

Also the answer to most questions is "lurk more".
>> No. 20092 [Edit]

I've been lurking for a while. I'm asking these questions based on what I've seen from my lurking.
>> No. 20096 [Edit]
>I guess I can say I understand the "moe" feeling
Actually you have no idea if you've never had a crush on a character. Who did you like when you were a kid? I was into Jessie from Pokemon.

>how people are able to feel so connected and passionate for characters that have such a limited window of "growth"
When you can take a character seriously, you can seriously imagine any possible life she could live. Like, reimagine her surroundings. You're probably aware of how characters aren't tied to their stories. You can imagine Romeo and Juliet, but it's Ranma and Akane, and when everything ends no one knows who's supposed to be who. You can also go read that story. Rei and Asuka could have both grown up to be loving housewives, right? Like, how many layers of anime are you even on? If you're not into it there's no point researching.
>> No. 20097 [Edit]
>Actually you have no idea if you've never had a crush on a character.
What I meant was that I can understand the idea behind it. There are characters in anime and games that I've felt an emotional impulse to protect and care for, but not much beyond that point. There are doujin that I've read that I've felt ill from my repulsion at how a character was being treated, and had to stop reading midway. But I couldn't see myself devoting myself to the concept of one of these characters.

>When you can take a character seriously, you can seriously imagine any possible life she could live.
I'm familiar with that. I've just noticed at least a couple posts on here that seem to be strict about sticking purely to canon. Although, that does seem to be a significant minority.

Another thing that both added to my confusion and to my drawing parallols with a religion or (pseudo-)spiritual belief is the "waifu shrine". Why do you construct them? Do you ever stop and think that the companies producing all of the merchandise are taking advantage of waifuists - both occidental and oriental?
>> No. 20098 [Edit]
I have heard a lot, and I mean a lot of waifuists that claim the personality of their waifu is the most important thing, but, if her artsyle changed drastically is she still the same character as long as her personality remained? What if she was reimagined caninically in a way you no longer find attractive?
>> No. 20099 [Edit]
That's a good question.

Characters consist of a "personality", a "history", and an "aesthetic". While it could be argued that personality and history are significantly important, at what point does changing the aesthetic change the character? Would your waifu still be your waifu if she was suddenly retconned into a trap? If she still had the same personality, the same history - everything was the same, except she was now he?
>> No. 20101 [Edit]
My waifu is the way she is because I find her perfect and the most lovable in both aesthetic and personality. Changing the art style to a degree won't make me not love her, but I would be lying if I said her looks weren't one reason I fell for her in the first place.

It all differs by person, though.
>> No. 20102 [Edit]
That makes sense. If the change is minor, then it's irrelevant, and if the change is significant, it's effectively a different character, right? Plus, I've noticed a lot of Touhou waifus, and the official art style is generally a lot lower quality than that of the spinoff games and fan works.
>> No. 20104 [Edit]

Anime is very standardized and they usually do not make unnatractive females but they can "update" or "reimagine" characters and change them a lot, when making a character usually their design matches their other attributes, the design is a part of the character.
>> No. 20105 [Edit]
True. The closest thing I can think of to that would be a character changed drastically in another medium's adaptation.
>> No. 20106 [Edit]
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There's a language that expresses personality and ideas in character design.

When you see Yuugi you'll instantly know she's wild (yankee hair) and outgoing and likes drinking. Pretty intense with the red theme (horn and eyes). She's also a former prisoner, and a strong one at that, casually lifting the weight of her manacles while gesturing. Her blouse adds to the sporty feeling, and her sandals imply she's traditional (blood and honor -era?). She also poses like she's the boss around here. These things are called kyara in Japan and that's considered a subset of the full character profile. I'd call the language that helps us know characters at first glance the kyara language.

The translation works in the other direction, too. Knowing a character's personality limits the range of acceptable portrayals.

It's ok to make Yuugi not greenish because that's not a real characteristic, i.e, not a word in the language. It's not ok to make her physically diminutive or unathletic. Some people really like glasses and want to draw a meganekko Yuugi, but I think that makes no sense.

PS. I remember there being a guy whose waifu had nothing besides her kyara. Still found a husband. Iirc there are some people who argue that moe is felt towards kyara and not the character herself.

PPS. Just thought there were many posts skirting around this topic while not properly touching it.
>> No. 20107 [Edit]
That actually does explain quite a bit.

Another question, regarding the moe: Where are the lines between attraction, affection, sympathy, and love? At what threshold, for lack of a better term, do you consider your feelings towards a character to be love?
>> No. 20108 [Edit]
Attraction is when my brain gives me the DAYUM signal.
Affection is when I like her and take her side.
Sympathy is when I feel her joys and sorrows.
Love is when she has no faults and they just make her that much cuter anyway.
>> No. 20111 [Edit]
I guess that's why I just don't "get" it. The first three I've felt in various combinations, sometimes even all at once. But I've never felt the last quality about a character. And, while I hold nothing against any of you for feeling so, I don't know if I ever could or would.
>> No. 20113 [Edit]
Frankly, I don't think that normalfag video really captures the essence of this kind of culture, nor does it describe the way we actually feel about it.

I'm pretty sure that video was the reason why many normalfags started thinking that this kind of culture is one big joke in the first place.

Post edited on 21st Dec 2016, 2:35pm
>> No. 20115 [Edit]
Yeah, that video seemed really "off", which is the main reason I looked into this on my own.
>> No. 20116 [Edit]
lol i remember this.

>it's like when you call someone gar. you're not saying you're gay for the guy, it's saying he's fuckin' BAD-ASS

i haven't seen or heard the word 'gar' used in a super long time!
>> No. 20120 [Edit]
I don't have a waifu OP, so I'm not really qualified to comment on what it is like having one, or what it means to have one, however I do understand the concept of "moe" well and would like to offer a my own insight. Hopefully it my grant a little context.

For me, moe is about warmth and happiness, and vicariously fulfilling primal drives. I'm an adult man in my mid 20s, so at this stage of my life I have a number of paternal drives that, without children of my own, go unfulfilled. I watch shows that fall under the headers of CGDCT (cute girls doing cute things), moe, and slice of life, which tend to be interconnected.

The reason I watch a "moe" show like "Is the Order a Rabbit?", "Hanayamata", or the currently airing "Stella no Mahou" is because it gives me my dad jollies. These girls are sweet, earnest, playful, and simple, experiencing and exploring their childhood; these shows are built to play to my paternal drives. When I watch them engaging in their playful antics or struggle with different issues of their childhood, it fills me with warmth, and that warmth makes me happy. This is moe.

Although I am not a practicer of waifuism, nor do I ever intend to be, I do understand what it is like to have anime characters inspire a deep sense of warmth and happiness and can understand the bridge between "moe" and waifuism.
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