You can form a bond with just about anything given enough time. If 3D was easier, people wouldn't struggle with relationships as much as they do. Most normals can't stay focused on a single partner anyway. It's the norm for people to have been with dozens of partners over their life times. The average human is ]not monogamous. Normalfags cheat on their partners all the time, they take relationship breaks to sleep around, get divorced, or break up to find someone new, partake in one night stands, hook ups, booty calls, hire hookers, and have sex friends. What insensitive for a 3dpd is there not to anyway? You're not special to them and you never will be. Your just the latest person in a long line to take their turn with that 3dpd and chances are you wont be the last. Why commit to someone like that?

I think it's much easier to commit to an idea. Reality is always flawed and full of disappointment, but an idea can be anything you want it to be. Waifus can be whatever you want, whatever you're looking for is out there and can be built upon. In any color of the rainbow in all shapes and sizes, it a robot or a monster or an alien you name it. Once you've found perfection why settle for anything else? I've found my version of perfection, and it's been nine years since then.

"responsibilities" is hardly something I'd consider a good thing. Responsibilities are why I don't like having pets or even playing multiplayer games. It's just extra crap I don't need or want to deal with.
lastly, I don't partake in being sorry you got caught logic. You shouldn't need consequences to tell you not to cheat, it's called being a decent human being.

Great post, Tohno.
I can't think of anything else that needs to be said.

Life with 3dpd is unending struggle with little chances to find true love, or even good friends. Some people don't want to be part of the shitfest, but don't know how to go about finding the other decent humans. They refuse to let go of their ideals, but find it hard to go and realize it.

Many find that ideal in cute anime girls. They are not part of the struggle to be the king of the trash heap, so empathizing with them puts your heart at ease. Many find some kind of happiness in just consuming that heartwarming imagery. Some take it further and really dedicate themselves to the cute anime girl culture. Some get really deeply into yuri (the non-ecchi kind). For some, it's serial obsessing over different 2d girls, especially within a 'genre'. Some dedicate themselves wholly to a single waifu.

It may be that however you go about getting more deeply into cute anime girls (too bad CAG sounds kinda unpleasant), you'll end up dedicated to your one and only waifu.

OP here.
Just to be clear, I wasn't saying 3D are better or things like that, I was just trying to describe a problem I'm facing. Thank you for your interest and sorry for the wall of text.


>If 3D was easier, people wouldn't struggle with relationships as much as they do.[...]
Sure, but I can love a 2D girl today and another tomorrow. While in real life a relationship lasts at least some months (and in the most fortunate cases, a whole life).
>I think it's much easier to commit to an idea. [...]an idea can be anything you want it to be. Waifus can be whatever you want[...] In any color of the rainbow in all shapes and sizes, it a robot or a monster or an alien you name it.
That's exactly the problem I'm facing. If it can be anything, everyday I will fall in love with something different. It's the same reason why I don't like most open world games: after a while I don't know what to do anymore and there's no point in persisting with a single objective.
>I've found my version of perfection
This for example makes no sense to me: since perfection doesn't exist the idea of it will constantly change in my mind. So, for example, after say I've committed for a year to make Misaki Nakahara my waifu, I would likely change my mind and skip to Madotsuki.
The main point is that this happens exactly because they are 2D. When I had a real girlfriend my mind was all about her, because I was supported by real life, by everyday situations; e.g. she knocks on my door: I cannot ignore she is knocking on my door and that she's there, a girl who loves me, that's waiting for me to open that door. With 2D, I can just say to myself "fuck it, I'm browsing another girl in the internet, forget the other imaginary one knocking on the door".

>"responsibilities" is hardly something I'd consider a good thing. Responsibilities are why I don't like having pets or even playing multiplayer games. It's just extra crap I don't need or want to deal with.
I feel exactly the same! But on the other hand responsibility is an important part: it deeply connects yourself with another human being. With 2D there is no responsibility whatsoever, so it's very easy for me to change my mind and focus on another online/imaginary girl.

But obviously, a long lasting and deep relationship is more interesting to have (both 2D and 3D), and that's why, talking about 2D, I would prefer that; but all the reasons explained above do not allow me to live such a thing.

>Life with 3dpd is unending struggle with little chances to find true love, or even good friends. Some people don't want to be part of the shitfest[...]
I don't either. I can understand you because of my reclusive life-style and personality problems. But with 2D, while I don't have the problems you listed anymore, I face new ones, like picking a single girl and sticking with it, since there are literally thousands of girls I would be able to fall in love to, both in the 3D-imaginary-online and the 2D worlds.

With real life 3D, instead, you are limited by the events that happen in your life: for example, having a cute classmate girl, is an external event that manipulates your mind and makes you more inclined to fall in love with her than a random girl that lives on the other side of the world. Instead, with 2D I have all the internet: how can I bond with one single girl? If that's crazy in the real world, it is way more impossible IMHO on the internet, where there's no responsibilities and you can't form a bond with something so easily subject to change.

>>19859
>Sure, but I can love a 2D girl today and another tomorrow.
>"fuck it, I'm browsing another girl in the internet, forget the other imaginary one knocking on the door".
That's not love, dude.

You don't choose to love a girl out of literally thousands of girls. It just happens.
>with 2D I have all the internet: how can I bond with one single girl?
With 3DPD you have all the women in your vicinity: how can you bond with a single one?

2D love really isn't different from 3D love subject-wise, the big difference is the object of your love. In the real world you love the image you've made of a real person (it's always an approximation since you can't truly know a person), you'll most likely get disappointed by them, realize the person is quite different from what you've imagined which I think is the cause of most break-ups.
You love a 2D girl the same but she is the image, there's no discrepancy, she's probavly the perfect being in your eyes. She'll feel pretty real, if you really love her and you'll feel a responsibility even though you're aware of the fact that she only exists in your mind.

Your posts make me think that you can't imagine really falling in love with a 2D girl and that in tour eyes the only way for a relationship to survive is if there's responsibilities binding two human beings to each other even after the initial butterflies have vanished (which [the vanishing] is what I'd interpret as disappointment in the discrepancy of expectations and real person).
I know I'm talking out of my ass here, it's just my worldview, my take on "waifuism" (and love in general) and my impressions of you based on the little information in your posts.

>>19861
No, you're quite right, but maybe we should forget the matter of responsibility, that comes later anyway. The thing is that it's way too easy to like female anime characters.
You make a point:
>With 3DPD you have all the women in your vicinity: how can you bond with a single one?
The thing is that with 3D, 90% of the girls or more I don't give a fuck about. And if I find one that physically attracts me, 90% of the time I won't like her personality / I won't be able to approach her, etc.
With 2D, since you watch anime / play games / watch movies *that you like*, with characters that *you generally like*, you constantly find things/persons that you may like.
It's like browsing a porn fetish: you find 100 videos of the fetish you like: would you stick to one girl only in one video only? Very likely not. Instead, IRL, it's hard to find a girl who likes that same fetish, so once you find her you'll likely stick to her.

With 2D I cannot choose, as in my previous example, Misaki *OR* Madotsuki. You correctly say:
>That's not love, dude.
Of course but you get kind of desensitized, like you get desensitized with that porn fetish, you get desensitized of internet-girls after watching, reading and fantasizing about all these perfect girls: how can you fall in love with one in particular?

Maybe the internet desensitized me about girls, both 3D and 2D.
Maybe I'm not capable of love in general, and I can only dream of it.

>>19863
So you're like a "serial pervert", then? How do you feel about pure girls? And don't you dare "corruption is best" me, here. You feelin' the peace or what?

>serial pervert
Wut? In case it's not clear, the fetish thing was an example, to do a comparison and helping me make a point.
>How do you feel about pure girls?
The problem is the same: too many of them, which one?

>>19865
No dude I mean: how do they make you feel? Do you "want to protect that smile"?
And just for fun: what kinda girls are you into? Like, almost every anime at least nowadays can pull off a "good girl" character, but many of those are still nondescript. Many characters give the feeling they're just copypasted from somewhere else. What I'm getting at is how can you say there are "many" girls to "choose" from? How's everything hit all your weak spots?

Oh and if you're looking to fall in love, how about playing a good VN?

>>19868
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_novel
Basically it's about meeting a girl, following her storyline and falling in love.

>>19868
>Veee eehhnnn? What's that?
You stupid troll, why would you do that?
I'm a noob (about waifu) and I'm asking questions here without insulting and trying to be as polite as possible. Why do you have to do this stupid things?
I know what a VN is but that's not the problem, if I wouldn't it won't be a big deal, but doing what you just did means making fun of me and there's no reason to do that.
At least board owners can see the IP of the post I guess.

>>19866
>No dude I mean: how do they make you feel? Do you "want to protect that smile"?
I guess. I want to hug them and cuddle.

>And just for fun: what kinda girls are you into?
Shy, JB/teen, short black hair, overly attached to their bf.

>they're just copypasted [...] How's everything hit all your weak spots?
I don't know what to answer honestly.

>if you're looking to fall in love, how about playing a good VN?
Hrmmm... thanks for the suggestion.

But you see, while watching Clannad I became connected to Nagisa.
While watching Welcome to NHK I became connected to Misaki.
Etc.
They are way too much linked to their anime, I can't feel them part of my life. I'm not living what is happening in those anime, I'm living my own life where there are all these girls that I can potentially love.

>>19859
>Sure, but I can love a 2D girl today and another tomorrow. While in real life a relationship lasts at least some months (and in the most fortunate cases, a whole life).
Like others have said, it's not really love if it's just for a day. 3DPD relationships can and often do only last for a few days or a couple dates. There's no guarantee of of them lasting a month or more. Besides, people stick with boy/girlfriends they hate all the time. Sometimes because they're afraid of being single, are stuck with them for financial reasons, or because being with them is all they know.

>everyday I will fall in love with something different.
Again, that's not love. That's much closer to lust. A crush at best but not love.

>because I was supported by real life,
2D can be supportive to if you let it be. I mean I get what you're saying but you're being extremely vain in your approach to 2D. Sure some folks might get by with treating their waifu as nothing more than a pretty thing to look at, but in the years I've been at this I've seen many many people who's waifus gave them the support and encouragement they needed to keep going. Think of it like religion. Just because jesus(or any other god) isn't knocking on your door every day doesn't mean they can't offer support and guidance. I myself would often ask myself what my waifu would think of my actions and could say that she's been a big help in keeping me on the right path. Sure she isn't here to tell me lying cheating or stealing is bad, but I know in my mind she wouldn't approve of such things. I know it would trouble and bother her if I did immoral and deplorable things. She's not here to say so her self, but that's why you need a little bit of imagination and faith.

>With 2D there is no responsibility whatsoever,
On the surface maybe not, but you can create the responsibility if you so desire it. Create a representation of your waifu in your mind. Now imagine how she'd react if you forgot her birthday. Imagine how she'd respond to you cheating on her. Try to picture the look of sadness and disappointment in her eyes, try to think about how horrible she'd feel. This is what many people would typically do while thinking of their 3dpd counterpart anyway. After all, you wouldn't cheat on your 3dpd just to see how they'd react right? You already know how they'd react without having to experience it first hand, and this can be applied to waifus just as easily.

>>19863
>reading and fantasizing about all these perfect girls: how can you fall in love with one in particular?
Learn to be more picky then if that's really a problem for you. Most guys don't care about anything other than tits ass and hair. These low standards are why so many men put up with garbage 3dpd. People these days are trained to have low standards and accept anything they can get. This is something you can cast aside when dealing with waifus. You can be as picky as you please and the more picky you are the less options there's going to be as a direct result. They're not all perfect, you're just not being specific enough and true to your desires.

>you get kind of desensitized
The same logic can be applied to people who have multiple partners over the course of their life time. Realistically speaking as mentioned before most people going to have been with plenty of partners over their life time. Anything can loose it's kick if you indulge in it enough. Games get boring after playing them a dozen times, your favorite food makes you sick if you eat it too often, you'll get sick and tired of anything and everything eventually. This is why drug addicts and adrenaline junkies are always pushing themselves further and further. What used to give them a high doesn't anymore. No one likes to admit it but this can happen to people too. It's why you so often hear of marriages in which the sparks have faded, and who need help reigniting the flames. People can and do get sick of eachother over time. It's called the seven-year itch... well, it's become the three year itch now thanks to the current fucked up generation.

>>19868
No need to be a jerk, common.

>>19863
>The thing is that it's way too easy to like female anime characters.
>With 2D, since you watch anime / play games / watch movies *that you like*, with characters that *you generally like*, you constantly find things/persons that you may like.
Yes, like but not love.

>It's like browsing a porn fetish: you find 100 videos of the fetish you like: would you stick to one girl only in one video only? Very likely not.
I don't think this comparison is a good one, you don't look for a single specific person for a fetish, you want to fap and you don't really care who you fap to as long as you find them attractive and they fit your fetish.
>Instead, IRL, it's hard to find a girl who likes that same fetish, so once you find her you'll likely stick to her.
I understand what you mean, 3DPD is full of flaws and most characters in fictional works are idealized but that just makes it easier to like them. Love is completely different in my opinion.

>>19865
>The problem is the same: too many of them, which one?
The one you actually fall in love with. It's not a choice despite what most people seem to think.

Well, 2D love is just not for me then.
Probably 3D IRL either.
I'm fucked up by nihilism.

>>19875
Yeah, anime isn't for you.
Just drop the edgy snowflake act and you'll do fine.

>>19876
lol you're crazy

>>19875
I am quite the nihilist in the existential sense, so I guess I could put in a word or two here. I'll take your comment here seriously, since I suffered greatly through an existential crisis years ago; although, it was exasperated thanks to looking at things from the wrong perspective. Throwing my thoughts at a wall, as it were. In any case, someone else may be in need of these words.

Nihilism is irrelevant in light of your ability to construct your own meaning in life. That it is "subjective" takes nothing away from it, since your everything is an amalgamation of subjectivity. Indeed, we are gifted with an auspicious gift, and it is one that can render such woes "nil": we can change ourselves, our way of thinking. And we certainly do a lot of thinking, so much so that we can make problems from nothing. Look at it this way, if there is no "objective morals or reason to live" and all of that, would that not mean that your cares for those things are, just the same, rooted in subjectivity? Who are you to say that these things are required of this universe? Not I, surely. In the end, does it truly matter if there is no objective meaning behind our lives? I don't think so. You may wish for that direction now, since it may "ground" your life, as it were. It would be easier that way, you may be thinking, right? The universe hands you a list of rules and and everything's in its right and proper place.

This does not appeal to me at all, but if it does for you, then you'll have to take it upon YOURSELF to create this order amongst the chaos. Surely, you won't be an objective law of this reality, but you could do better than there being none at all, right? Besides, you're of this universe, yet another part of the whole, and though you may be small and objectively meaningless, you can carve out your own piece of happiness if you so choose. Of your own volition, through your own tempered will wrought of thought-stuff and flesh. That's inspiring, I think, even in light of all the despair and misery.

And on the point of 2D love: It isn't something that you go looking for, as if it was some sort of crusade. The best option is to be open to the idea of finding your love in whatever it is that you're reading/watching/playing/whatever, but to not force anything. For me, it was difficult to tell if I had actually fallen in love with a character "for true", since it had never happened before. Time and time again, you will hear stories of people feeling affection for a character, perhaps even friendship, they'll think it's a done deal, but then they come upon that fateful encounter and realize their mistake. It's only natural, after all. Love is a great many shades, is it not? I love my friends, even my pets, but I don't LOVE them in the same way.

I've read many times that, upon meeting their waifu, many people are struck with a strong feeling. A suffocating one, even. That was the case for me, and there was no room for doubting. I was most certainly in love. All of my other "relationships" with 2D characters were all-so-suddenly put into perspective. I enjoyed them and their company, related with their traits, and would be their greatest friends if given the chance, but none came close to the feeling I had for my waifu.

I don't know what concerns you still harbor after all of these posts, and they have covered much already, so I'll leave it at that and see if your response is something that I can expand upon. Hopefully we've availed you something.

>>19878
On nihilism.
I tried, anon. I tried. But after a while I get bored of anything.
Well, I guess this got OT.
Thanks all for the replies.

It's not for me either. Honestly, as someone who has had a waifu for a year, it's not worth it, aside from fantasy and/or delusion, to me it just felt like worshiping a idol like the pagans did, only this time I knew she didn't exist.

>With 3D is way easier, because you make a bond with a material living creature and therefore you get tangibile responsibilities.
>If you betray her you get to face real life consequences; so it may happen that you look at other girls, but then you just forget it and go on.
In my opinion, true love, regardless of whether it's 2D or 3D, is about putting her above yourself. You have legitimately come to love her more than your own life, your family members, everything. You stay with them, not because you're afraid of the social ramifications, but because all you want is their happiness and you pray to God you can help them be their happiest and more positive self. You want to shower her with respect and kindness, making sure her wants and needs are taken care of before your own. Yes, this may read as very idealistic, maybe even impossible to pursue, but I'm convinced it's worth pursuing.

If you're "facing a new girl" every day, then maybe you haven't found her yet, or maybe she's under your nose and you haven't realized how perfect she is. That's all fine, you'll just have to let nature take its course.

>but it's kind of impossible for me to just pick one and say «Ok I'll focus on her and she will be the only one».
It's a bit of a problem to talk about it like that, IMO. "Picking one" implicitly suggests waifus are replaceable, but I don't agree. When you find her, you'll realize you can't replace her with a 2D girl or a 3D one.

Hope that helps.

See, that's the thing; you're focusing on thought. Our lives as human beings are generally led through both thoughts and emotions-- just because you think you can't really focus on one girl doesn't mean the rest of your mind feels the same way.
When you fall in love with someone's concept, they become really special to you.

What you're facing everyday is a possibility. All things in life are possible, some with cosmically small odds, others with higher. Responsibilities have very little to do with forming a loving bond, I think you're thinking of interaction. There's ton of interaction to have with 2d concepts too, simply because they don't exist in our material realm doesn't mean they don't exist at all and that you can only love them from afar.

Yeah, but that's not how love works. You don't fall in love with a concept because it looks nice or feels nice, there's much more to it. You're mistaking potential love with potential infatuation. There are tons of potential mates out there, both 3d and 2d for everyone-- it's not entirely your conscious decision, though, and you can't really choose what you want to feel towards whom.

Last but not least, I feel like you need to reconsider your love priorities if you think you can just one day decide to dedicate yourself to one concept. It takes much more than simple thought to love.

I am late to the party.

>When I had a real girlfriend my mind was all about her, because I was supported by real life, by everyday situations; e.g. she knocks on my door: I cannot ignore she is knocking on my door and that she's there, a girl who loves me, that's waiting for me to open that door. With 2D, I can just say to myself "fuck it, I'm browsing another girl in the internet, forget the other imaginary one knocking on the door".

My experience is the opposite. I basically experience the same with 2D. My mind is all about her. She is "knocking the door" of my imagination or similar senses, telling me she is there. If I would say "fuck it", she will react in my imagination much like previous posts have described imagination to work. It would break my heart (and her heart) if I said "fuck it".

>Maybe I'm not capable of love in general, and I can only dream of it.

Maybe you have just not found your type of love.

I feel much of the same problem OP, I suppose I just am incapable of love. Too much self doubt to allow myself to love, because of the fear that if I did love it might not be the real thing. I feel like love, for me, would not merely be adoration for a person, but the interaction and back and forth between me and them that forges an unbreakable bond, for me love is active and a current, not just a one way output for myself towards an object of worship. I think it's too hard for me to have a waifu because if I loved someone, I would want them to be with me and interact with me every second of my life. Of course, I've never felt love before, so this is merely speculation. Sadly I cannot go to the 2D world, and there is no person in this world whom I could form a complete bond of trust, love, and compatibility with, so I must live a loveless life. I am happy for those of you who can love their waifu though, and I do envy you.