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29983 No. 29983 [Edit]
Replies: >>36617
i usually have a hard time finding anime that isnt all about tits and ass and that is full of moe crap and panty shots. like good plot and three dimensional characters n shit

DURARARA is up there, same with Cowboy Bebop and aldnoah zero and some others. recommendations from the peanut gallery /a/?
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>> No. 29986 [Edit]
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29986
>full of moe crap
A lot of the users here like moe, please don't insult it when you are going to post here.
>> No. 29997 [Edit]
http://tohno-chan.com/an/res/14094.html

Just gonna leave this here.
>> No. 36065 [Edit]
Replies: >>36066
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36065
Ergo Proxy.

Much of it is a loose, personal interpretation of Gnosticism, and the protagonist very much follows the pattern of a Gnostic Hero, who is not out for fame or power but first and foremost on a quest to find out the truth about himself and the world. The Hypostasis of the Archons is a good place to start reading on Gnosticism if you're unfamiliar with it.

It also touches on issues like genetic engineering and AI, and philosophical problems with modern humanism.

The plot moves very quickly in the beginning of the show, to the point of being confusing. After episode 10 or so the plot slows to a crawl and instead the psyche of the main characters and the world they live in is explored.

Some people call it pretentious because the first few episodes namedrop a lot of concepts and figures from Western philosophy without really doing anything with them, but that's so you can read up on those ideas and people early on and enjoy the rest of the show.
>> No. 36066 [Edit]
Replies: >>36068
>>36065
>that's so you can read up on those ideas and people early on and enjoy the rest of the show
Can you enjoy the rest of the show without reading up on those ideas and people?
>> No. 36067 [Edit]
>i usually have a hard time finding anime that isnt all about tits and ass and that is full of moe crap and panty shots. like good plot and three dimensional characters n shit
Well considering that the characters are 2D by definition...

Joking aside, if all you've found are "tits and ass" and "moe crap" then you clearly have not put in any effort to find shows. I pretty much _only_ watch those SoL shows that you've dismissed as "moe crap" (and note that the appeal of these shows isn't in the fanservice but rather the pure depictions of friendship), and even I'm aware of various shows that lie along the lines of those you've already mentioned: besides the various gundam/mecha shows, you've got Watanabe's various works (Space Dandy et al.). Basically just look for pre-2005-ish shows.
>> No. 36068 [Edit]
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36068
>>36066
sure you can, it just helps you to think about the events in the show in a different light, and perhaps get a better clue as to what the creators were trying to tell you.

Although if you watch raws, it might be hard to understand some of the vocabulary. It certainly was to me.
I know enough Japanese to understand every word in your average shounen/isekai/romance anime, but EP uses a lot of obscure terminology that I guess you'd only know if you've been reading about Western philosophy and Jungian psychology in Japanese.
It helps to see these terms written out in Kanji, but I couldn't find a version with Japanese-language subtitles anywhere. I would've even bought the Blu-Ray if it had that, but it only has English subtitles.
Luckily someone posted transcripts of all episodes of Ergo Proxy on his blog:
http://blog.livedoor.jp/animeoyazi/archives/cat_27788.html
>> No. 36085 [Edit]
Replies: >>36086
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36085
>> No. 36086 [Edit]
Replies: >>36087
>>36085
I can never take any of these charts seriously, because they often just end up being "anime that I liked" without actually making an attempt to separate out orthogonal dimensions. Taking your example, I don't see how Marisama ga Miteru should be proximal to Lain. Sure they may both be "ATMOSPHERIC [sic]" but they fulfill that definition in two different ways.

I've always wanted something closer to a map (perhaps hypermap) of anime where shows are clustered in some high dimensional space and the different attributes are separated out. Of course finding what exactly these dimensions is itself a non-trivial task (*) but the real difficulty is going to be assigning any meaning to whatever dimensions you end up extracting. But maybe that's fine, even if you don't know what exactly the dimensions mean, you still have some notion of distance and orthogonality so you can intuitively explore shows in relation to other shows.

(*) I suspect it's very similar to the famous netflix prize problem. You could do so via a local approach (neighborhood models/clustering) or a global approach (sparse matrix factorization).
>> No. 36087 [Edit]
Replies: >>36088 >>36128
>>36086
>I've always wanted something closer to a map (perhaps hypermap) of anime where shows are clustered in some high dimensional space
Huh, why? I doubt something that complicated would help a person find what they would enjoy more effectively. Genres, demographics, and best of all, recommendations from those with similar taste, are already effective.
>> No. 36088 [Edit]
Replies: >>36089 >>36620
>>36087
You wouldn't (/couldn't) actually explore the high-dimensional space itself, the raw embeddings would be used in various fashions. For instance clustering ("find anime having characteristics of both X and Y", "anime like X, Y, Z but not Q"), or use it to do lower-dimensional projections (set dim1 as the trait shared by "X, Y, Z", set dim2 as the trait maximally different between "X, Y, Z" then project onto {dim1, dim2} and explore).

>Genres, demographics
Genre/demographics would implicitly be included as dimensions. Again, this could be done either via traditional (non-ML approach) kind of similar to "recommendation systems" which have well-studied solutions in the form of matrix factorization (e.g. SVD, which would directly give you a set of orthogonal dimensions), or from newer ML techniques (there's probably some fancy way to compute embeddings from ratings, shows that are talked about together frequently, etc.).

>and best of all, recommendations from those with similar taste, are already effective.
But that's exactly the goal – Ideally if there were someone with the same tastes as you who had knowledge of the entire anime corpus, you could use their recommendations. But of course such people often don't exist, and if you do have any friends their tastes may only partially overlap with yours. Which is why if you aggregate together all this info to get a matrix of ratings/recommendations, you can then go from a "local" view to a "global" view to tease out the various features a show could have and how important these features are to each person who rated.

--

I think it should actually be feasible to do this since people have scraped the MAL profiles (UserAnimeList.csv). This gives you a setup basically identical to the netflix prize, I wonder if anyone has ever tried to do stuff with that.
>> No. 36089 [Edit]
>>36088
Possibly relevant: https://github.com/racinmat/mal-analysis
There are a few recommendation related things on there (seems there was even a kaggle contest at one point). Also some interesting charts
>> No. 36128 [Edit]
>>36087
I'm probably exactly the kind of person whom that would be made for, because I already kind of think like that. I can "see" how things are similar or dissimilar and that they lie on something like a spectrum between one thing and another.
>> No. 36617 [Edit]
>>29983
Have you tried YURI ON ICE?
>> No. 36620 [Edit]
>>36088
>there's probably some fancy way to compute embeddings from ratings
At this point I'm sure you could probably just use transformer models as an arbitrary tool to compute these clusterings. It's a strict superset of word2vec type similarity things, and it clearly have leaned some embedding. Although I just tried on one and without prompting it recommended Higurashi as something similar to NNB (first two were k-on and yuru camp though), after more prompt examples it managed to do decently. It manages to do general clustering (anime like X anime) but doesn't manage to get semantic relations right (anime like X but without Y theme).
>> No. 36636 [Edit]
Replies: >>36638
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36636
Yeah, I'm tired of all this SOL moelove on this website. I feel a hunger arising in my veins...I have a desire throbbing away deep inside. I need more chuuni media in order to regain the strength to contain this demon that I have sealed in this right hand of mine...The very fate of the world depends on it!
>> No. 36638 [Edit]
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36638
>>36636
Fool! If you think a simple wordfilter will thwart my plans then you are gravely mistaken. When the prophecy is fulfilled evil will return to earth and all of your precious SOL shows will be destroyed...and I will be there laughing.
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